Sandra Bernhard on Beauty Standards, Severance, and Surviving a Dystopian America
There is no ceiling that Sandra Bernhard has left unshattered. It was her biting and groundbreaking stand-up comedy that first rose her from relative obscurity to international levels of acclaim, pioneering her way through the late 1970s and 80s.
But before her searing performances and numerous iconic late-night appearances, she was cast by Martin Scorcese in 1983 to appear in his black comedy drama flick, The King of Comedy. Two years later, I’m Your Woman, Bernhard’s one-woman show, cemented her status as an independent, fearless female icon. In 1991, she took on the role of Nancy Bartlett on Roseanne, becoming one of the first actresses to openly portray a bisexual woman on mainstream television.
Since then, Bernhard has commandeered everything from Playboy to Broadway, and starred as Nurse Judy in Ryan Murphy’s Pose.
Most recently, she has taken a role in Apple TV+’s supernova sci-fi thriller, Severance, and is about to embark on a U.S. tour for her new live show, Shapes & Forms.
Our publisher, Kristin Prim, caught up with Sandra to talk beauty standards, her upcoming tour, and how to survive in an increasingly dystopian America.
KP: I’m not going to be able to resist starting full circle here. One of the executive editors, Emma Reese, at my last media outlet, The Provocateur – which was merged to form Noir – spoke to you back in 2020 right after COVID hit. We were in the middle of that incredibly crucial election, which Joe Biden eventually won.
But you ended that conversation by saying, “I can’t even imagine what this country or the world will look like if we don’t get [Trump] out of the White House, so I think that’s my number one concern right now. Everything – from social reckoning to the politically correct and all the rest of it – is kind of on the back burner until we can just get back our equilibrium. That’s my final message right now. It’s hard to look back and talk too much about the way things are when you’re in the middle of an emergency.”
As depressing and disheartening as it is to say, I feel like we might have found ourselves now in a much worse situation than we were in then, where not only have women’s rights been rapidly stripped, but our very once-sacred and very just democracy is being directly threatened every day.
As someone who has always been very politically active and incredibly forthright, how are you feeling? How can we avoid becoming fatigued and jaded in such a demoralizing climate when we need to fight the hardest?
SB: It takes discipline and focus to stay ahead of this situation. As an artist and performer, I put my energies into uplifting people through my performances knowing and trusting – like all chaotic, uncertain times – that this too shall pass. Not to say that things won’t be left in total disarray, but we have to forge ahead, reaching out and bringing people along who may not have the fortitude that we do. Taking hiatuses throughout the day from news and social media is also a must – know the facts and keep on moving.
KP: Looking back at where we were then versus where we are now, I feel like there are quite a few things that I would tell my younger self, particularly when it comes to what matters most. Is there anything that you would tell your younger self in general?
SB: We all look back and see where we stumbled, but those were all essential moments where we learned out to get up and dust ourselves off. No one can tell you how to navigate your life – just be there when you’re ready to ask the right questions.
KP: The last time we spoke with you, you talked very openly about not looking up to the same women that most Americans do in terms of beauty standards, which really took off. So many women related to and found refuge in that.
SB: You have to learn to be comfortable in your own skin, now more than ever. There are so many beauty inspirations from places we never drew from before – that is a wonderful revolution.
KP: Absolutely. And to quote, you said, “The American idea of beauty and the blonde next door with the little tiny nose – I don't find that appealing. I like somebody who's got features and curves and has a bravado about them. Those were the women that I found more inspiring, and I kind of modeled myself after all of them.”
SB: Yes! I want women from every walk of life to be celebrated, and now they are. It’s a game changer.
“Life can be fun sometimes… you just need to shed your skin to get there.”
KP: I remember many women contacting us after that ran and asking for similar advice regarding confidence in identity. You played Nancy Bartlett on Roseanne at a time when LGBTQ representation was incredibly rare, but you’ve never shied away from who you are or who you loved, regardless of how well-accepted or ill-accepted it was at the time.
SB: Well, we all need to put on our blinders and connect with like-minded people. We need to find our tribes and welcome in others who are just now finding their footing. Life can be fun sometimes… you just need to shed your skin to get there.
KP: Where have you found the strength and confidence to be so authentically yourself?
SB: I think I just came into it naturally. I knew that I didn’t fit into the mundane and eventually I just blossomed.
KP: What would you tell someone who is struggling with personal acceptance?
SB: For those who aren’t as confident, they’ll figure it out in their own time.
KP: You’re host of the incredible Sandyland, your radio show on SiriusXM. I started picking up these conversations on Noir just recently – and I’m certainly not a journalist – but branching out and speaking with people has taught me so much. Getting to delve into each woman’s life that we speak with is so enriching – it’s been a great gift to speak to so many iconic women, such as yourself. Is there any favorite moment that you’ve had from expanding into media?
SB: Yes, I’ve found that there are people in unexpected places who listen to me and really get what I’m putting out there. It reminds me to not have misconceptions about people from certain parts of this country – there are interesting, adventurous people everywhere.
KP: I spoke with Margaret Cho not too long ago, who talked about her experience of working with you on Percy Jackson and the Olympians, calling herself a “Bernhardtologist,” which was very funny. I’m sure it was great to work with her, too.
SB: Very much so! Margaret is an iconoclast. She does things her own way and I truly admire that.
KP: What have some of your favorite recent projects been? What do you seek out today when you’re taking a role? Has it changed over the years?
SB: I’m just excited to get offers for eclectic roles that I don’t have to audition for – Severance, Percy Jackson, Survival of the Thickest… I love working with unique talent and have the support to do my best work.
KP: You just starred as a nurse on season two of Severance, much to the surprise of so many viewers. What can you tell us about the role and how it came to be?
SB: Ben Stiller reached out to me a year ago to see if I would be interested in taking a role. Needless to say, I was. He is a brilliant talent – there’s really no one else like him.
KP: The show itself deals with deep societal and psychological themes, particularly those relating to work-life balance. Did getting involved in its world make you think differently about any societal norms or common practices that we accept that perhaps we shouldn’t?
SB: I’ve never been in the nine-to-five grind, but I’ve know plenty who have, and this show speaks to them. It’s a disrupter – it’s absolutely brilliant.
KP: You’re returning to the stage across America this spring and summer with your new show, Shapes & Forms. Your work has always blended social commentary with sharp wit – how do you decide which topics to tackle? What can we expect from Shapes & Forms?
SB: It’s a melange of social commentary, witty asides, reminiscences, and songs that weave it all together. I try to take people on a journey that zig-zags on and off the main highways… that’s always my goal.
KP: What do you think of the current landscape for comedy today? Do you find it hampered due to the prevalence of cancel culture, or incredibly rich given the absolute hellscape that we’re currently living in?
SB: I always stick to my guns and tackle topics within my wheelhouse. I know what makes me laugh and what moves me. That’s what I do… and I don’t second guess myself.
KP: What do you feel makes a provocative woman?
SB: That’s something that I leave up to you and my audience. I would never be so presumptuous to try and explain that mystery.
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Photography: Nick Spanos
